'postively fifth street' 'bringing down the house'

[ThrillaInManilla]

does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
you suggest some to me?

[skasher]

Amrillo Slim win first prise when it comes to stories

"ThrillaInManilla" <fortyoz2freedom20@msn.com> wrote in message
news:92ee6f36.0307310815.5a8ca3bc@posting.google.com...
> does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
> looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
> you suggest some to me?

[dickwells]

PFS is a worthwhile read, I have not read the other. I am about halfway
through Poker Nation by Andy Bellin and at the paperback price it too is a
good read, so far. RW
On Jul 31 2003 11:15AM, ThrillaInManilla wrote:

> does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
> looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
> you suggest some to me?

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[docholiday]

I can't understand how people think Pos 5th street is well written. It
reeks of a cheap detective novel during the binion trial elements, and the
poker sections will only be of interest to people who love the game. "Too
literary?" maybe for grade schoolers.


On Jul 31 2003 10:20AM, NWBurbsCouple wrote:

> 5th Street is very well-written, and I loved it, but it might be too
"literary"
> for some and might not have enough gambling stories for you.

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[Jarrod Millar]

Bringing down the house is a great book. It is extremely well written,
and easy to read. Theres some scandal, back stabbing, all true,
everything a good gambling book should have. It is very interesting how
the kids from MIT hit the casinos.


On Jul 31 2003 12:15PM, ThrillaInManilla wrote:

> does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
> looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
> you suggest some to me?

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[Buckwheat]

In article <3f29478d$0$5024$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>,
"docholiday" <anonymous@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I can't understand how people think Pos 5th street is well written. It
> reeks of a cheap detective novel during the binion trial elements, and the
> poker sections will only be of interest to people who love the game. "Too
> literary?" maybe for grade schoolers.
>
>
> On Jul 31 2003 10:20AM, NWBurbsCouple wrote:
>
> > 5th Street is very well-written, and I loved it, but it might be too
> "literary"
> > for some and might not have enough gambling stories for you.
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com
>
>



While not amongst the finest books ever written, I think any quality
writing about poker is given a bit of a break.
The reason for the break is the rather slim reading one would have if
one were to have EVERY book written about poker that had any literary
credibility.

The truth is, quality writting about poker wouldn't even fill a shelf of
a small bookcase in your home, so you almost have to look at all the
"non how to" books with a grain of salt.

And........who would buy PFS if they didn't already love
poker?.......not me.

Positively Fifth Street is a no brainer add to your poker library.

[Chris Leishear]

On Jul 31 2003 12:15PM, ThrillaInManilla wrote:

> does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
> looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
> you suggest some to me?

I enjoyed them both. Buckwheat's choices are right on also. And there
are two books by Michael Konik worth getting - "Telling Lies and Getting
Paid" and "The Man With The $100,000 Breasts."

My favorite poker-related novel is "King of A Small World". Its a great
mix of poker and story, and takes place here in Maryland so it made it
that much more enjoyable for me.

One more idea is to Google for trip reports by any of the following:
Tiltboys
Sgt. Rock
Cambodian Slick

-Chris

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[M.F.]

I have read a pre-pub. copy,sans photos,and i can tell you take it out on
loan from the libary ..here is a La couriel for you to inquire and rcv.
any book your heart desires related to gambling/gaming that can be
had...howard@gamblersbook.com..tell him rgp sent you. M.F. hope this
helps you.

On Jul 31 2003 9:15AM, ThrillaInManilla wrote:

> does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
> looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
> you suggest some to me?

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[Floppy]

On Jul 31 2003 12:45PM, docholiday wrote:

> I can't understand how people think Pos 5th street is well written. It
> reeks of a cheap detective novel during the binion trial elements, and the
> poker sections will only be of interest to people who love the game. "Too
> literary?" maybe for grade schoolers.
>
>
> On Jul 31 2003 10:20AM, NWBurbsCouple wrote:
>
> > 5th Street is very well-written, and I loved it, but it might be too
> "literary"
> > for some and might not have enough gambling stories for you.

I've got a proposition for you. We submit "Positively Fifth Street" and a
modern poker book of your choosing to the most tenured professor of
literature at Harvard. We post $5000 each. We let him or her settle the
matter. By the way, there's two "L's" in "Holliday," Doc.

Floppy

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[Lanky Bob]

> I can't understand how people think Pos 5th street is well written. It
> reeks of a cheap detective novel during the binion trial elements, and the
> poker sections will only be of interest to people who love the game. "Too
> literary?" maybe for grade schoolers.

To say this book "reeks of a cheap detective novel" is truly doing it a
disservice. It would be hard to cover a topic like murder with
sadomasochistic sex elements without sounding a little cheap--it's a cheap
topic. The book is very well written. I mean, c'mon, the guy writes for
Harper's, one of the preeminent LITERARY mags in the country. While the
book isn't exactly great literature, it does more with poker--especially
its history and science, making both highly accessible and
interesting--than other books of similar intent.

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[docholiday]

Uh, nice proposition Floppy, what side are you taking? If you're just
talking in the genre of poker books, of course the field is extremely
limited, I haven't read Holden or Bellin so I can't comment if this book
is the best "poker book" in terms of quality. I in fact enjoyed the poker
parts (and skipped over the trial elements) because like most poker
players, I enjoy any decently penned tale about poker in general. But in
terms of great writing in general, this book did not meet the grade.

By the way, thanks for the tip on my name spelling, it's a handle you
moron.


> I've got a proposition for you. We submit "Positively Fifth Street" and a
> modern poker book of your choosing to the most tenured professor of
> literature at Harvard. We post $5000 each. We let him or her settle the
> matter. By the way, there's two "L's" in "Holliday," Doc.
>
> Floppy

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[Gary Carson]

On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 16:52:58 GMT, Buckwheat

>
>1) "Biggest Game in Town" Al Alverez
>2) "Positivley Fifth Street" James McManus
>3) "Big Deal" Anthony Holden
>4) "Poker Nation" Andy Bellin
>

Big Deal is one of the few poker books I thought was a complete waste
of time.

I'ts just way too much like a bad Walter Mitty story for my taste.

Biggerst Game in Town is very good. I havn't read Positively Fifth
Street yet, Poker Nation I think falls into the "it's okay" catagory.

Although not a poker book, I think Uston's Big Player book (is that
the title? Is it still in print?) would be a better choice than Big
Deal. For a real story about a gambler/writer who took a year off to
do it full time, get a copy of Beyer's My $50,000 Year at the Races (I
think that's out of print). Beyer was a real writer and a real
gambler, unlike Holden who was a real writer and a wannabe gambler.



Bringing Down the House, the story of the MIT blackjack players is #6 on the list this week
List of Top Ten Gambling Books
http://garycarson.rediffblogs.com/
updated July, 20th
Mezrich's Bringing Down the House #11 last week

[Gary Carson]

http://mcmanus.rediffblogs.com/

has links to a couple of reviews of positively 5th street

I havn't found any reviews of Bringing Down the House but it's selling
well.

On 31 Jul 2003 09:15:06 -0700, fortyoz2freedom20@msn.com
(ThrillaInManilla) wrote:

>does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
>looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
>you suggest some to me?

Bringing Down the House, the story of the MIT blackjack players is #6 on the list this week
List of Top Ten Gambling Books
http://garycarson.rediffblogs.com/
updated July, 20th
Mezrich's Bringing Down the House #11 last week

[Adam Ardis]

Bringing Down the House was a good(true) story, well written, and a very
easy read. My only criticism was how the writer left it, which I guess
can't be made up or embellished if it's non-fiction. :) It just left me
asking what happened next, but maybe that's the key to a good book,
fiction or not?

ThrillaInManilla wrote:
> does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
> looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
> you suggest some to me?

[Buckwheat]

In article <3f296f0b.61383852@news.mindspring.com>,
garycarson@alumni.northwestern.edu (Gary Carson) wrote:

> On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 16:52:58 GMT, Buckwheat
>
> >
> >1) "Biggest Game in Town" Al Alverez
> >2) "Positivley Fifth Street" James McManus
> >3) "Big Deal" Anthony Holden
> >4) "Poker Nation" Andy Bellin
> >
>
> Big Deal is one of the few poker books I thought was a complete waste
> of time.
>
> I'ts just way too much like a bad Walter Mitty story for my taste.
>
> Biggerst Game in Town is very good. I havn't read Positively Fifth
> Street yet, Poker Nation I think falls into the "it's okay" catagory.
>
> Although not a poker book, I think Uston's Big Player book (is that
> the title? Is it still in print?) would be a better choice than Big
> Deal. For a real story about a gambler/writer who took a year off to
> do it full time, get a copy of Beyer's My $50,000 Year at the Races (I
> think that's out of print). Beyer was a real writer and a real
> gambler, unlike Holden who was a real writer and a wannabe gambler.
>
>
>
> Bringing Down the House, the story of the MIT blackjack players is #6 on the
> list this week
> List of Top Ten Gambling Books
> http://garycarson.rediffblogs.com/
> updated July, 20th
> Mezrich's Bringing Down the House #11 last week

Uhhhhh.....gee Gary, the original post was from a guy looking for books
to read, ........but why don't you let the guy read it and then form his
own opinion.

Your view of the book, however, contradicts the prevailing opinion on
"literary" poker books. It's also fully within your right to say
whatevery you want!

Your recomendation of a book that you don't know the title of, and you
don't know if it's in print is of no help to anybody.

I have absolutely no sense of Anthony Holden as a "wannabe gambler".

.........as I said, Anthony Holden's book, titled "Big Deal" is
considered a must read if you are looking beyond the how to books. Once
you have read it, you may form your own opinion on it, as I have, and as
Gary has.

[Gary Carson]

On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 21:49:57 GMT, Buckwheat

>
>Uhhhhh.....gee Gary, the original post was from a guy looking for
books
>to read, ........but why don't you let the guy read it and then form
his
>own opinion.

Oh gee, I guess I'm just not literary enough to know how to read.

I thought he'd asked for suggestions as to "fun gambling books to
read". Silly me.

I don't think Big Deal is a "fun gambling books". I think it's a
self-indulgent walter mitty story. My some people think it's a good
book, maybe most, but I don't.


>
>Your view of the book, however, contradicts the prevailing opinion
on
>"literary" poker books. It's also fully within your right to say
>whatevery you want!
>

Exactly how would my view contradict that prevailing opinon?

My view contradicts the prevailing opinion on whether or not Big Deal
is a good book or not. What does that have to do with my view or the
prevailing opinion on literary poker books. Why do you put literary
in quotes?

>Your recomendation of a book that you don't know the title of, and
you
>don't know if it's in print is of no help to anybody.

If didn't help you. But, I bet someone who wanted to find a good
gambling story to read could find the book based on my description.
It didn't help you because you're a lazy buffon who wants someone else
to tell you what to think. I assume that because you seem to put more
credence into the idea of prevailing opion on literary poker books
than I think a prevailing opinion deserves.


>
>I have absolutely no sense of Anthony Holden as a "wannabe gambler".

Did you read the book?

>
>........as I said, Anthony Holden's book, titled "Big Deal" is
>considered a must read if you are looking beyond the how to books.
Once
>you have read it, you may form your own opinion on it, as I have, and
as
>Gary has.


It's not a must read at all. It's boring. It's self-indulgent. It's
a waste of time.

It's the story of a writer who got a book contract to do a book on
what it's like to spend a year as a professional gambler. But, he
doesn't really spend a year as a professional gambler. He spends a
year trotting around the globe playing in celebrity type poker
tournaments. It's not a good gambling book. It's not a good travel
book. Some people like it though. You might be one of them.


Positively 5th Street is 7th on the list this week
Bestseller list
http://garycarson.rediffblogs.com/

[Floppy]

On Jul 31 2003 8:30AM, docholiday wrote:

> Uh, nice proposition Floppy, what side are you taking? If you're just
> talking in the genre of poker books, of course the field is extremely
> limited, I haven't read Holden or Bellin so I can't comment if this book
> is the best "poker book" in terms of quality. I in fact enjoyed the poker
> parts (and skipped over the trial elements) because like most poker
> players, I enjoy any decently penned tale about poker in general. But in
> terms of great writing in general, this book did not meet the grade.
>
> By the way, thanks for the tip on my name spelling, it's a handle you
> moron.
>
>
> > I've got a proposition for you. We submit "Positively Fifth Street" and a
> > modern poker book of your choosing to the most tenured professor of
> > literature at Harvard. We post $5000 each. We let him or her settle the
> > matter. By the way, there's two "L's" in "Holliday," Doc.
> >
> > Floppy

I'm betting on 5th Street, and don't be so hostile. If you are going to
diss the likes of McManus while advertising yourself as a Doc Holliday
fan, the least you can do is familiarize yourself with Holliday's name a
little better. And only modern "gambling" books count (as I said) in the
proposition, so as to disinclude Dostoevsky and TWANE.

For my money, 5th Street is so head and shoulders above the field that
it's like comparing Tiger Woods to Annika Sorenstam. Mismatch; which
doesn't mean Sorenstam can't play. She certainly can. Seriously though, I
compared McManus' treatment of the WSOP and the Binion murder trial to
Shakespeare - and I meant it. The rave reviews rolling in for 5th Street,
not in the poker world, but across the literary world, are well
documented. It's the only "poker book" that DOES make this grade. So if
you are going to take exception to it, fine. But at what the hell is the
evidence? If you come on here and say Sugar Ray Robinson doesn't "make the
grade" as a fighter, okay. But you might need to do a little explaining.

Floppy

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[DanielRentzer]

If your looking for good gambling stories. I suggest Amarillo Slim in a
world full of fat people as the best book on gambling stories. Also Cowboy
Wolford's book is good and Oklohoma Johnny Hale has a pretty good book as
well. Positively Fifth street has more on the Binion story as well as some
good gambling stories, however I am only half way through this book. I
think Positively fifth street will pretty much just cover the WSOP and the
binions...I will find out. So far Positively Fifth street is pretty slow
going...I liked Amarillo Slims book because it was tough to put down and
the stories stick into your head!!


On Jul 31 2003 9:15AM, ThrillaInManilla wrote:

> does anyone have these books or can tell me if they are any good. im
> looking for some good fun gambling stories to read. if not these, can
> you suggest some to me?

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[Buckwheat]

In article <3f2990fe.70076268@news.mindspring.com>,
garycarson@alumni.northwestern.edu (Gary Carson) wrote:

> On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 21:49:57 GMT, Buckwheat
>
> >
> >Uhhhhh.....gee Gary, the original post was from a guy looking for
> books
> >to read, ........but why don't you let the guy read it and then form
> his
> >own opinion.
>
> Oh gee, I guess I'm just not literary enough to know how to read.
>
> I thought he'd asked for suggestions as to "fun gambling books to
> read". Silly me.
>
> I don't think Big Deal is a "fun gambling books". I think it's a
> self-indulgent walter mitty story. My some people think it's a good
> book, maybe most, but I don't.
>
>
> >
> >Your view of the book, however, contradicts the prevailing opinion
> on
> >"literary" poker books. It's also fully within your right to say
> >whatevery you want!
> >
>
> Exactly how would my view contradict that prevailing opinon?
>
> My view contradicts the prevailing opinion on whether or not Big Deal
> is a good book or not. What does that have to do with my view or the
> prevailing opinion on literary poker books. Why do you put literary
> in quotes?
>
> >Your recomendation of a book that you don't know the title of, and
> you
> >don't know if it's in print is of no help to anybody.
>
> If didn't help you. But, I bet someone who wanted to find a good
> gambling story to read could find the book based on my description.
> It didn't help you because you're a lazy buffon who wants someone else
> to tell you what to think. I assume that because you seem to put more
> credence into the idea of prevailing opion on literary poker books
> than I think a prevailing opinion deserves.
>
>
> >
> >I have absolutely no sense of Anthony Holden as a "wannabe gambler".
>
> Did you read the book?
>
> >
> >........as I said, Anthony Holden's book, titled "Big Deal" is
> >considered a must read if you are looking beyond the how to books.
> Once
> >you have read it, you may form your own opinion on it, as I have, and
> as
> >Gary has.
>
>
> It's not a must read at all. It's boring. It's self-indulgent. It's
> a waste of time.
>
> It's the story of a writer who got a book contract to do a book on
> what it's like to spend a year as a professional gambler. But, he
> doesn't really spend a year as a professional gambler. He spends a
> year trotting around the globe playing in celebrity type poker
> tournaments. It's not a good gambling book. It's not a good travel
> book. Some people like it though. You might be one of them.
>
>
> Positively 5th Street is 7th on the list this week
> Bestseller list
> http://garycarson.rediffblogs.com/

YAWN......

[Buckwheat]

In article <3f2990fe.70076268@news.mindspring.com>,
garycarson@alumni.northwestern.edu (Gary Carson) wrote:

> On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 21:49:57 GMT, Buckwheat
>
> >
> >Uhhhhh.....gee Gary, the original post was from a guy looking for
> books
> >to read, ........but why don't you let the guy read it and then form
> his
> >own opinion.
>
> Oh gee, I guess I'm just not literary enough to know how to read.

I guess not.
>
> I thought he'd asked for suggestions as to "fun gambling books to
> read". Silly me.

OK, you are silly.
>
> I don't think Big Deal is a "fun gambling books". I think it's a
> self-indulgent walter mitty story. My some people think it's a good
> book, maybe most, but I don't.

Nobody cares what you think.
>
>
> >
> >Your view of the book, however, contradicts the prevailing opinion
> on
> >"literary" poker books. It's also fully within your right to say
> >whatevery you want!
> >
>
> Exactly how would my view contradict that prevailing opinon?

Most people think it's a good read, you don't.....you're in the minority.
>
> My view contradicts the prevailing opinion on whether or not Big Deal
> is a good book or not. What does that have to do with my view or the
> prevailing opinion on literary poker books. Why do you put literary
> in quotes?

Because I "felt like it".
>
> >Your recomendation of a book that you don't know the title of, and
> you
> >don't know if it's in print is of no help to anybody.
>
> If didn't help you. But, I bet someone who wanted to find a good
> gambling story to read could find the book based on my description.
> It didn't help you because you're a lazy buffon who wants someone else
> to tell you what to think. I assume that because you seem to put more
> credence into the idea of prevailing opion on literary poker books
> than I think a prevailing opinion deserves.

Oh dear Gary....you've insulted me! ...What a powerful man you are.
As I said, no good to anybody.
>
>
> >
> >I have absolutely no sense of Anthony Holden as a "wannabe gambler".
>
> Did you read the book?

Only a fool would ask that question....FOOL.
>
> >
> >........as I said, Anthony Holden's book, titled "Big Deal" is
> >considered a must read if you are looking beyond the how to books.
> Once
> >you have read it, you may form your own opinion on it, as I have, and
> as
> >Gary has.
>
>
> It's not a must read at all. It's boring. It's self-indulgent. It's
> a waste of time.

OK, I'll change my mind........idiot.
>
> It's the story of a writer who got a book contract to do a book on
> what it's like to spend a year as a professional gambler. But, he
> doesn't really spend a year as a professional gambler. He spends a
> year trotting around the globe playing in celebrity type poker
> tournaments. It's not a good gambling book. It's not a good travel
> book. Some people like it though. You might be one of them.

I did like it, you did not. I am not bitter, you are the angry man
incarnate.
>
>
> Positively 5th Street is 7th on the list this week
> Bestseller list
> http://garycarson.rediffblogs.com/



.........You are a twit.

[RTN4]

On Fri, 01 Aug 2003 01:11:10 GMT, garycarson@alumni.northwestern.edu
(Gary Carson) wrote:

>I don't consider stories about how he fenced stolen goods to be
>gambling stories.
>
>He's a theif and a cheat. If you want interesting stories from a
>theif read "Catch Me if You Can".

And you're a boor, but we still let you post.

[docholiday]

quote: familiarize yourself with Holliday's name a little better

Ok Floppy, next time I have to come up with a handle I'll do a thorough
investigation on the etymology of whatever noun I choose, and be certain
to put the second 'l' in for your sake.

Oh, and please retype your reply again and try to put in one more horrible
sports analogy for our sake.

If you can't see why the book is only decently penned, then I can't
explain it to you. If you are going to judge books soley on the genre
they are in, then I guess some Harlequin romance novels are worthy of
critical acclaim and literary awards.

but argueing with you is like....uh.....me being..uh...Michael
Jordan...and you a...not ..so good...player....ya, that's it.


> I'm betting on 5th Street, and don't be so hostile. If you are going to
> diss the likes of McManus while advertising yourself as a Doc Holliday
> fan, the least you can do is familiarize yourself with Holliday's name a
> little better. And only modern "gambling" books count (as I said) in the
> proposition, so as to disinclude Dostoevsky and TWANE.
>
> For my money, 5th Street is so head and shoulders above the field that
> it's like comparing Tiger Woods to Annika Sorenstam. Mismatch; which
> doesn't mean Sorenstam can't play. She certainly can. Seriously though, I
> compared McManus' treatment of the WSOP and the Binion murder trial to
> Shakespeare - and I meant it. The rave reviews rolling in for 5th Street,
> not in the poker world, but across the literary world, are well
> documented. It's the only "poker book" that DOES make this grade. So if
> you are going to take exception to it, fine. But at what the hell is the
> evidence? If you come on here and say Sugar Ray Robinson doesn't "make the
> grade" as a fighter, okay. But you might need to do a little explaining.
>
> Floppy

_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com

[Gary Carson]

On 01 Aug 2003 16:26:17 GMT, "docholiday" <anonymous@hotmail.com>

>
>If you can't see why the book is only decently penned, then I can't
>explain it to you. If you are going to judge books soley on the
genre
>they are in, then I guess some Harlequin romance novels are worthy of
>critical acclaim and literary awards.
>

Some might be, I don't know. But, we'll never know and that's becuase
books are often judged primarily on the genre they are in.




Positively 5th Street is 7th on the list this week
Bestseller list
http://garycarson.rediffblogs.com/