Jeff Porten
05-01-2005, 02:06 PM
LKJ wrote:
> If I'm getting really good odds, I'll go ahead and call with suited cards
> or connectors out of the BB, but what about trash like J5o, K4o, etc.?
> Are they worth a call to see a flop if I'm getting like 11-1 odds?
> Just wanted some opinions, I'm still within my first year of playing
> and the intricacies of some odds are still a little beyond me.
Big difference here between J5 and K4.
First off, your first question is *which* 5-6 players came in. If one
of those guys is a reasonably tight player, then there's an excellent
chance you're up against a decent A or pocket pair. At the very least
you have to credit the guy with a better drawing pocket than you do. In
this case, fold.
On the other hand, if the 5-6 players are the guys who play almost every
hand, then basically you're playing your trash against what's mostly
other trash. Although with 5-6 hands, chances are one of those guys
actually has a hand worth calling, which is why you still need the flop
to hit you hard.
Finally, keep in mind that all trash is not created equal. There's a
big difference between Kxo and Jxo; the K has a better chance of holding
up on a K-high flop. In this case, I'd jam the flop, hoping to hit my
kicker on the turn. Whether I'd bet out, call, or fold on the turn and
river would be based on a) whether my opponents are being more
aggressive than usual, and b) whether the board was otherwise low or
high. With K4, you want a board where you're going to chop with K7 or
K8 if that's the trash your opponents play. But a low board where the 8
plays cuts into your equity, which isn't high to begin with.
I sometimes play this from the blind, but I wouldn't be surprised if my
lifetime net at this hand was a small loss.
> If I'm getting really good odds, I'll go ahead and call with suited cards
> or connectors out of the BB, but what about trash like J5o, K4o, etc.?
> Are they worth a call to see a flop if I'm getting like 11-1 odds?
> Just wanted some opinions, I'm still within my first year of playing
> and the intricacies of some odds are still a little beyond me.
Big difference here between J5 and K4.
First off, your first question is *which* 5-6 players came in. If one
of those guys is a reasonably tight player, then there's an excellent
chance you're up against a decent A or pocket pair. At the very least
you have to credit the guy with a better drawing pocket than you do. In
this case, fold.
On the other hand, if the 5-6 players are the guys who play almost every
hand, then basically you're playing your trash against what's mostly
other trash. Although with 5-6 hands, chances are one of those guys
actually has a hand worth calling, which is why you still need the flop
to hit you hard.
Finally, keep in mind that all trash is not created equal. There's a
big difference between Kxo and Jxo; the K has a better chance of holding
up on a K-high flop. In this case, I'd jam the flop, hoping to hit my
kicker on the turn. Whether I'd bet out, call, or fold on the turn and
river would be based on a) whether my opponents are being more
aggressive than usual, and b) whether the board was otherwise low or
high. With K4, you want a board where you're going to chop with K7 or
K8 if that's the trash your opponents play. But a low board where the 8
plays cuts into your equity, which isn't high to begin with.
I sometimes play this from the blind, but I wouldn't be surprised if my
lifetime net at this hand was a small loss.